Replay

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Racer2112
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Re: Replay

Post by Racer2112 »

smidge34 wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 5:07 pm
Things like me jumping Brett’s arse over a high dribble by opposition when a high dribble isn’t necessarily a violation and like a player in possession of the ball on the floor can slide and it isn’t a “travel”. Lol I’m trying hard every game lately to shut up and at least attempt to see the game objectively and it’s hard.
If you’re thinking back to the EIU game the diving/slide with the ball wasn’t a travel, but the rolling over with it definitely was lol. It’s not our jobs as fans to see the game “objectively” we wouldn’t be there all season if we didn’t have a rooting interest. The atmosphere would also suck. I also try to give the refs a lot of room for errors, and I’m the first to admit when they blow a call in our favor.

I have noticed in 109 this year we all seem to be trying to not jump the officials from the start, but usually somewhere between the 12-8 timeout in the second half we have all had enough :lol:
Dan T wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 5:39 pm
I'm gonna disagree with the part about being "legalistic." I don't think there is any denying that there are some really uneducated and completely biased fans at the games, and when I say "uneducated," I'm talking about education in basketball. And by calling them uneducated and biased, I'm being polite.
“Strict adherence to law rather than the spirit.” We all know the spirit of those terms even if they are not technically correct in the laws of basketball.

I think there are a lot of uneducated and/or completely biased people in pretty much every gathering of people, but using the phrase “over the back” does not mean someone doesn’t know the game or has a bias. When trying to discern if someone knows the game I want to see what they say about offensive sets, defensive systems and rotations, etc.

The thread is about replays on the video board. Even though there are a lot of fans that have a low basketball IQ or have big bias is that a reason to withhold information from them? I don’t think so. Seeing the replay should help them control there bias than relying on what they saw in real time when the refs ultimately make there decisions (assuming they make the correct one). A replay may help educate people who don’t really know the game. Maybe it prompts them asks a question, look up a rule, or overhear their neighbors talk about why that was the right call.

I guess I don’t see what the downsides are to showing the replay, but I see some upsides.

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Re: Replay

Post by Dan T »

As we see everyday, "facts," do not matter to those whose minds are made up. Instead, it will only confirm their bias and accelerate their bad behavior.

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Re: Replay

Post by smidge34 »

smidge34 wrote:
Mon Feb 03, 2020 9:31 am
Ok boomer. :mrgreen:
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Re: Replay

Post by wallaceracer »

Dan T wrote:
Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:42 am
As we see everyday, "facts," do not matter to those whose minds are made up. Instead, it will only confirm their bias and accelerate their bad behavior.
In this case I would tend to disagree. I think we are blessed with a very educated basketball fanbase. There's a few, just like anywhere, that will complain no matter what, but overall our fans know the ins and outs of the game. That being said, when I go back and watch a replay of the game, about 75% of the calls that I complained about at the game turn out to be good calls, or calls that maybe could have gone either way but not just blatantly bad like I originally think.

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Re: Replay

Post by 75Fan »

For me, it's more about the no-calls than the bad calls.


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Re: Replay

Post by JoeD »

Inconsistency, thy name is OVC Officiating...
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Some hoax

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Re: Replay

Post by breds20 »

I was informed that the NCAA made a rule change on walking when on the ground. You can move from one butt check to the other as long as you are not advancing the ball. I haven’t had time to look it up. I’m also trusting a former player on that rule. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️

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Re: Replay

Post by jcruse64 »

Dan T wrote:
Mon Feb 03, 2020 9:33 pm
smidge34 wrote:
Mon Feb 03, 2020 6:40 pm
I laugh myself at the dude behind me yelling “over the back you idiot are you blind?!” but it’s still a pushing foul, just semantics.
I disagree. Fans want "over the back called" when a player for the other team rebounds from behind a player for the team he's rooting for, no contact needed. They actually think it's against the rules to rebound from behind another player.
I yell"over the back" quite a bit. Along with "reach in". Not as basketball knowledgeable as you, but I do realize there is no such foul in the rules as "over the back" or "reach in", per se, it's just the action/motion the opposing player is making when they make ILLEGAL contact with our Racer being fouled. Those terms have been used for years in describing how how the contact foul happened, and it's become part of the vernacular. It may drive you to distraction to hear a fan call for it (not necessarily blaming you on that; it drives me up a wall to hear a commentator use the "downhill runner" term in football), but the fan may be screaming for the call in that way because they saw the player draw illegal contact in that way. Most of us DO get it that rebounding over a player's back is perfectly legal, if no contact is initiated by that player in the act. Maybe you're letting your judgement get a little clouded. Not all of us in the lower section of 102 are complete neanderthals...

I, for one, as one of the "rowdies" would appreciate some replay, to see what actually DID happen. I promise to try not to confirm your pronouncements upon the unwashed masses in the lower bowl, DanT :mrgreen: :mrgreen: . Many times, we do not get a good view of the contact, or lack of. But, I have no problem calling out a ref when poor or inconsistent officiating is obvious, as DanT can confirm. I AM trying to be a little quieter about it this season, though, and just yell encouragement for the team. I do not believe in threatening a ref over a kid's game, but they better be ready for some ribbing if they can't call it competently. I guess if we all had to take a turn at it, we might button it up a little :crazy:

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Re: Replay

Post by wallaceracer »

breds20 wrote:
Fri Feb 07, 2020 3:15 pm
I was informed that the NCAA made a rule change on walking when on the ground. You can move from one butt check to the other as long as you are not advancing the ball. I haven’t had time to look it up. I’m also trusting a former player on that rule. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️
I thought it had more to do with the player's feet moving, but I don't know the actually rule either.

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Re: Replay

Post by Dan T »

jcruse64 wrote:
Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:01 pm
Dan T wrote:
Mon Feb 03, 2020 9:33 pm
smidge34 wrote:
Mon Feb 03, 2020 6:40 pm
I laugh myself at the dude behind me yelling “over the back you idiot are you blind?!” but it’s still a pushing foul, just semantics.
I disagree. Fans want "over the back called" when a player for the other team rebounds from behind a player for the team he's rooting for, no contact needed. They actually think it's against the rules to rebound from behind another player.
I yell"over the back" quite a bit. Along with "reach in". Not as basketball knowledgeable as you, but I do realize there is no such foul in the rules as "over the back" or "reach in", per se, it's just the action/motion the opposing player is making when they make ILLEGAL contact with our Racer being fouled. Those terms have been used for years in describing how how the contact foul happened, and it's become part of the vernacular. It may drive you to distraction to hear a fan call for it (not necessarily blaming you on that; it drives me up a wall to hear a commentator use the "downhill runner" term in football), but the fan may be screaming for the call in that way because they saw the player draw illegal contact in that way. Most of us DO get it that rebounding over a player's back is perfectly legal, if no contact is initiated by that player in the act. Maybe you're letting your judgement get a little clouded. Not all of us in the lower section of 102 are complete neanderthals...

I, for one, as one of the "rowdies" would appreciate some replay, to see what actually DID happen. I promise to try not to confirm your pronouncements upon the unwashed masses in the lower bowl, DanT :mrgreen: :mrgreen: . Many times, we do not get a good view of the contact, or lack of. But, I have no problem calling out a ref when poor or inconsistent officiating is obvious, as DanT can confirm. I AM trying to be a little quieter about it this season, though, and just yell encouragement for the team. I do not believe in threatening a ref over a kid's game, but they better be ready for some ribbing if they can't call it competently. I guess if we all had to take a turn at it, we might button it up a little :crazy:

Joe
"Clouded judgement" is a term that can easily be used in two directions.

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Re: Replay

Post by jcruse64 »

Dan T wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 10:26 am
"Clouded judgement" is a term that can easily be used in two directions.
For sure. A lot of us rowdies generally would side with our Racers, in any situation that at first blush appears to have gone against the Racers. Most regular fans are not going to be completely impartial during the course of a game. When we see an opposing player reach around our player and slap at the ball, we're generally going to cry "reach-in", not because we saw the arm reach in for the ball, but because we observed the defender contacting our player while also contacting the ball. If it was really close on whether personal contact was initiated, we'll holler, because we thought we observed personal contact. Nothing in that situation necessarily shows a complete lack of understanding of the rules of the game by the fans crying for the "reach-in" foul that seems to get you bent out of shape, Dan T. Fans may be too quick to jump on a situation, or push it with the reaction, because of clouded judgement via bias for the Racers.

I think your distaste for your more vocal, fellow fans has a bias that has clouded your judgement on what would happen if the fans were given replay.

(edit; fixed poor spelling, I think)

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Re: Replay

Post by smidge34 »

I like your style jcruse, I feel like you’re my lawyer defending me to a tee lol. The home crowd isn’t supposed to be impartial lol, we’re there to raise hell and support our team.
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Re: Replay

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smidge34 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 12:27 pm
I like your style jcruse, I feel like you’re my lawyer defending me to a tee lol. The home crowd isn’t supposed to be impartial lol, we’re there to raise hell and support our team.
:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Thanks, lol. Look, there is more than one type of attendee at these games. I've been going to Racer games since I transferred from PCC to Murray State for the 1984-85 school year. Seen a bunch of games in those years. You get folks that go, just to have something to do, or be with a group, or be seen, and are not really fans or care about the outcome. You get casual fans of the program or casual fans of the game itself, who really don't get invested in either of the teams or the outcome. You get fans who are more fans of the game itself than of either participant, and just interested in the play of the game. You get fans who are really invested in the game AND the Racers, who are really passionate about both and wear their passion "on their sleeve", so to speak. You get the really invested fan in the Racers and the game itself who are NOT the type to show that passion outwardly, even a little bit. All types coming to the same game. I DO believe that a passionate fan can cross the line of good behavior; I have done it before, but have been working on not doing that (verbal personal attacks on participants or refs or coaches; physical would be way beyond the pale and I don't think I've ever seen that). Things like loudly offering the refs my prescription glasses are getting towards that point, though I try to be comical about it...

What I HAVE noticed over the years are the regular fans who are not vocal and demonstrative in their support at each game, yet who, by their body language and/or their vocal responses, make it clear they do NOT appreciate their fellow fans who ARE vocal and demonstrative in their support at these games. I get it if you do not cheer and support the team they same way I do, and I have no business running you down or looking at myself as the "better fan". On the other hand, neither do you have any business doing that. Just because a fan gets loud in support of the team in calling for a foul is no reason to suspect they will be incited to riot and violence if replay is afforded to us all on the big screen over a call/non-call, nor to opine that that fan has NO real knowledge of the game and its rules. Your paintbrush is dripping a little self-righteousness, Dan T, IMO.

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Re: Replay

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I have to come to DanT’s defense a little, he’s been attending Racer games before most of us were born lol and that’s saying something for an old AARP card packer like myself. He’s just one of those you mentioned who doesn’t wear his passion on his sleeve.
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Re: Replay

Post by jcruse64 »

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: Hey, I completely understand, when a fan does NOT want to be vocal and all; everyone's different. It's just that I've noticed Dan T can paint with a somewhat broad brush when the subject of vocal fans comes into a thread, or IS the thread. More power to him and the other quiet but no less staunch fans. They make up the Faithful, too, and the Racer players and staff want us ALL there to both enjoy the games and support them. I wish us ALL the best and another trip to The Dance.

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Re: Replay

Post by Dan T »

jcruse64 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 1:47 pm
smidge34 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 12:27 pm
I like your style jcruse, I feel like you’re my lawyer defending me to a tee lol. The home crowd isn’t supposed to be impartial lol, we’re there to raise hell and support our team.
:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

Thanks, lol. Look, there is more than one type of attendee at these games. I've been going to Racer games since I transferred from PCC to Murray State for the 1984-85 school year. Seen a bunch of games in those years. You get folks that go, just to have something to do, or be with a group, or be seen, and are not really fans or care about the outcome. You get casual fans of the program or casual fans of the game itself, who really don't get invested in either of the teams or the outcome. You get fans who are more fans of the game itself than of either participant, and just interested in the play of the game. You get fans who are really invested in the game AND the Racers, who are really passionate about both and wear their passion "on their sleeve", so to speak. You get the really invested fan in the Racers and the game itself who are NOT the type to show that passion outwardly, even a little bit. All types coming to the same game. I DO believe that a passionate fan can cross the line of good behavior; I have done it before, but have been working on not doing that (verbal personal attacks on participants or refs or coaches; physical would be way beyond the pale and I don't think I've ever seen that). Things like loudly offering the refs my prescription glasses are getting towards that point, though I try to be comical about it...

What I HAVE noticed over the years are the regular fans who are not vocal and demonstrative in their support at each game, yet who, by their body language and/or their vocal responses, make it clear they do NOT appreciate their fellow fans who ARE vocal and demonstrative in their support at these games. I get it if you do not cheer and support the team they same way I do, and I have no business running you down or looking at myself as the "better fan". On the other hand, neither do you have any business doing that. Just because a fan gets loud in support of the team in calling for a foul is no reason to suspect they will be incited to riot and violence if replay is afforded to us all on the big screen over a call/non-call, nor to opine that that fan has NO real knowledge of the game and its rules. Your paintbrush is dripping a little self-righteousness, Dan T, IMO.

The last time I yelled at a referee was in my early 20's. Like the Terminator, my CPU is a learning computer. Plus, I don't like giving the appearance of poor judgement in public. It seems you have a problem with my opinion. I will continue to not worry about it.

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Re: Replay

Post by jcruse64 »

Dan T, I have no more of a problem with your opinion than you have with the opinions of some of the other Racer fans, given some of your posts in this thread and others. Glad your not worried, I honestly would not want you to be, nor should you be. My opinion is really not worth that much anyway.

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Re: Replay

Post by dbstepside »

Anyone else listen to the Froggy broadcast during the game? Heard our announcers use the term “On the back” at least 7 times. I know it’s not the correct name for a type of foul but it is common terminology for basketball fans across the country.

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Re: Replay

Post by speck »

I was raised up with refs calling over the back, my son was raised up fouling over the back not a big deal ever. Just another foul, has the wording changed over the years ?

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Re: Replay

Post by jhughes42071 »

Dan T wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 4:49 pm
Plus, I don't like giving the appearance of poor judgement in public.

It seems you have a problem with my opinion. I will continue to not worry about it.

Not trying to stir stuff here but if you don't like giving the appearance of something don't you inherently worry about their perception of your opinion?

The only people I will yell at are coaches and refs. They are being paid to be there and to do their job well. If I don't think that's the case then I'll be vocal. As far as whether you think I should or shouldn't welll....it seems like you have a problem with my behavior and I will continue to not worry about that.

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