#12

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02Racer
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Re: #12

Post by 02Racer » Tue Jan 28, 2020 4:01 pm

Remember last season when Coach Mac referred to Ja Morant as "one of the greatest basketball players in all the world" and even some here scoffed at the idea? :lol:
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Re: #12

Post by smidge34 » Tue Jan 28, 2020 4:05 pm

02Racer wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 3:55 pm
Sure, it’s unprecedented, but so is Ja Morant.
That’s the best answer given right there. Pluto is the limit.
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Re: #12

Post by atlantaracer » Tue Jan 28, 2020 5:13 pm

Casey

I am with you on Ike. I wasn’t around to see Les Taylor play, but I understand from some highly trusted sources that he was also extremely good during his tenure.

Any comments from those who witnessed Taylor?
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Re: #12

Post by JoeD » Tue Jan 28, 2020 5:16 pm

Steve Nash (Santa Clara)
Artis Gilmore (Jacksonville)
Bill Russell (San Fransisco)
Oscar Robertson (Cincinnatti)
Elgin Baylor (Seattle)
Ralph Sampson (Virginia)
David Robinson (Navy)
Damian Lillard (Weber St)

These are CBB program defining players. Ja Morant has the ability and opportunity to be among these types of players.

I AM NOT SAYING HE IS AS GOOD AS THESE PLAYERS. not yet anyway

You might even say that we should only look at what he did at Murray State. Okay. He was a consensus first team All American, number 2 overall draft pick, Lute Olson Award Winner, Bob Cousy Award Winner, OVC POY, 2 time OVC All Conference, first Racer with multiple triple doubles, OVC record for most assists in a season, lead the NCAA in assists, first NCAA player to average 20 points and 10 assists per game for a season. In fact, of the 52 games in Racer history where a Racer had 10 or more assists, Ja Morant has 23 of them. he is also one of 8 players in NCAA history to record a triple double in the NCAA tournament. He is also the only player in the last 20 seasons to have at least 40 points, 10 assists, and 5 steals in a game.

He deserves his number in the rafters.
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Re: #12

Post by SoILRacer » Tue Jan 28, 2020 7:39 pm

Congrats to Ja. I agree it’s quick, but he is deserving.

That said, I feel like we have to discuss Cam now, as well. What he accomplished on his way to becoming our first lottery pick after just 2 years with us was unprecedented. Cam and Sip getting drafted sure didn’t hinder Ja’s decision to come to Murray.
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Re: #12

Post by A_1985_grad » Tue Jan 28, 2020 8:24 pm

Yes, it's quick, but not the quickest at MSU. Remember the volleyball girl a couple of years ago whose number was retired DURING HER SENIOR SEASON?

We're all in agreement that Ja's number would eventually be retired, but I do believe we've gone retired number happy. And I'm with Smidge, if I understood him correctly, that I'm not crazy comfortable with administrators who'll spend maybe five years at the university apparently making these decisions. Just doesn't sit right.
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Re: #12

Post by NKYRacer » Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:02 pm

JoeD wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 5:16 pm
In fact, of the 52 games in Racer history where a Racer had 10 or more assists, Ja Morant has 23 of them.
That is awesome, I love stats like that :thumbup:
A_1985_grad wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 8:24 pm
Yes, it's quick, but not the quickest at MSU. Remember the volleyball girl a couple of years ago whose number was retired DURING HER SENIOR SEASON?
To be fair Benny Purcell's 21 was retired immediately after he led them to the 1952 NAIB National Championship game, well not immediately, but I'm pretty sure it was official before he graduated.

As for the running out of numbers thing. It was discussed in a late 50's board of regents meeting that, after the university retired it's first three numbers in about a five-year span, they should show more restraint.
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Re: #12

Post by 02Racer » Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:09 pm

I can’t imagine anyone has a problem with the numbers retired in recent years, right?

I mean, if you’re not going to retire Marcus and Sip’s numbers, might as well can the whole concept.
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Re: #12

Post by Dan T » Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:29 pm

atlantaracer wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 5:13 pm
Casey

I am with you on Ike. I wasn’t around to see Les Taylor play, but I understand from some highly trusted sources that he was also extremely good during his tenure.

Any comments from those who witnessed Taylor?
I've posted so much in the past about Taylor that others probably roll their eyes when they read it. He wasn't tall. He wasn't a drop dead shooter, but he could play any of the 5 positions better than anyone else on the team. He was the fiercest competitor that I've seen in a Racer uniform. When it came time to determine the outcome of a game, you wanted him on your side.
Last edited by Dan T on Wed Jan 29, 2020 5:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: #12

Post by A_1985_grad » Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:34 pm

I guess it's a good problem to have, but as you take a number out of circulation, you make it a little harder in the recruitment process. Say a hot shot high schooler is interested in coming to MSU, but he wears No. 30 and wants to keep wearing it. Then the recruitment comes down to us and, say, Belmont, where 30 is available. He could very well use that as the tie-breaker. (This kind of thing has happened, so I hear.)

I always believe you save number retirements for the very best of the best. When you start letting the "very good" in, then there is always another "very good" player people want in. Was Marcus Brown really that much better than Hector Blondet or Claude Virden? Was Popeye Jones really that much better than Jim Jennings or Dick Cunningham? Was Garrett Beshear really that much better than Stew Johnson or Isaac Spencer? Was ANYBODY better than Isaac Spencer? Or, yes, Les Taylor, for crying out loud?

(Before anyone jumps my case, yes, Ja Morant is among the very best of the best.)
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Re: #12

Post by JoeD » Wed Jan 29, 2020 6:51 am

I think we will at some point open all of those numbers back up for use. But I will say this...

It isn’t a bad thing to teach a little history with the numbers.
“Oh good choice of number. Claude Virden wore that number. He was one of the greatest to ever play here at Murray State...”
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Re: #12

Post by Kyracer » Wed Jan 29, 2020 7:07 am

smidge34 wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:07 am
Racer2112 wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:05 am
smidge34 wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:03 am
One day we are gonna run out of legal numbers at the rate we retire them.
At some point you just hang jerseys and let the numbers be worn again right?
You’d think so. Off topic, but our overzealousness has resulted in one hanging up there that is just a head scratcher to me, especially considering there is a prior player who wore the same digits who is infinitely more deserving.

The decision to retire a number is a BIG TIME decision to be made by temporary university employees who have no long term history with the program and who may not even be here in 5 years, imho.
Paul King was a great Murray player and superb defensively but I have always scratched my head on that one. Les Taylor who wore number 30 as well was one of the best ever imo. Issac Spencer career stats are incredible. I agree about running out of numbers but he is deserving. Ja, well once in a lifetime player and weren’t we honored to watch the genius of his play!
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Re: #12

Post by dropkick » Wed Jan 29, 2020 7:17 am

I remember someone saying years ago Paul was the only MSU Racer in history to start on 4 OVC championship teams and that led to his number being retired.
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Re: #12

Post by ERacerHead » Wed Jan 29, 2020 10:40 am

Different colleges have different rules. Not really sure what ours are, but found this link interesting.
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-baske ... -graduates
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Re: #12

Post by victorisgod » Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:03 pm

A_1985_grad wrote:
Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:34 pm
I guess it's a good problem to have, but as you take a number out of circulation, you make it a little harder in the recruitment process. Say a hot shot high schooler is interested in coming to MSU, but he wears No. 30 and wants to keep wearing it. Then the recruitment comes down to us and, say, Belmont, where 30 is available. He could very well use that as the tie-breaker. (This kind of thing has happened, so I hear.)

I always believe you save number retirements for the very best of the best. When you start letting the "very good" in, then there is always another "very good" player people want in. Was Marcus Brown really that much better than Hector Blondet or Claude Virden? Was Popeye Jones really that much better than Jim Jennings or Dick Cunningham? Was Garrett Beshear really that much better than Stew Johnson or Isaac Spencer? Was ANYBODY better than Isaac Spencer? Or, yes, Les Taylor, for crying out loud?

(Before anyone jumps my case, yes, Ja Morant is among the very best of the best.)
If someone doesn’t want to be a Racer just because a number isn’t available, I don’t want em.
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Re: #12

Post by jhughes42071 » Wed Jan 29, 2020 5:33 pm

I think it’s important to put everything under the appropriate lens. The bulk of the folks in this forum either grew up in, live in or or at one point resided in Kentucky. One of the richest states in college basketball tradition. As such we’ve become accustomed to University of Kentucky’s one and dones. Lottery picks and professional players galore here in the bluegrass.

We have a number two draft pick with virtually no ceiling talent wise that was borne out of a mid major program in a rural area. Yes this mans jersey should be in the rafters. No it’s not too soon. For two years I was able to see what is potentially one of the greatest basketball players to have played in this state and maybe even the nation.

Moral of the story we are spoiled with success and this shouldn’t even be a question.
Last edited by jhughes42071 on Wed Jan 29, 2020 5:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: #12

Post by speck » Wed Jan 29, 2020 5:45 pm

jhughes42071 wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 5:33 pm
I think it’s important to put everything under the appropriate lease. The bulk of the folks in this forum either grew up in, live in or or at one point resided in Kentucky. One of the richest states in college basketball tradition. As such we’ve become accustomed to University of Kentucky’s one and dones. Lottery picks and professional players galore here in the bluegrass.

We have a number two draft pick with virtually no ceiling talent wise that was borne out of a mid major program in a rural area. Yes this mans jersey should be in the rafters. No it’s not too soon. For two years I was able to see what is potentially one of the greatest basketball players to have played in this state and maybe even the nation.

Moral of the story we are spoiled with success and this shouldn’t even be a question.
Well said.
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Re: #12

Post by ERacerHead » Wed Jan 29, 2020 6:31 pm

I don’t want to be a naysayer on this thread since I agree that if anyone should have his jersey retired it is Ja, but still I have two questions I‘m not sure of the answers on retiring Murray State Jerseys.
1. Who makes the decisions about this at MSU?
2. Do we have criteria and if so are they published anywhere?

Anybody know? Thanks in advance if you do.
Last edited by ERacerHead on Wed Jan 29, 2020 7:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: #12

Post by racerlover » Wed Jan 29, 2020 6:37 pm

I don't know Paul King's career stats (I could look it up but I'm lazy), but I've seen him play. He was one of the most dynamic players to take the floor. He had moves that were so quick, that his defender would go one way and Paul would go the opposite direction. He most certainly was a key player on this title team's and deserves to have his number in the rafters. As for those before Martin, Mann and King, I can't speak to them. I never saw any of them play.
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Re: #12

Post by smidge34 » Wed Jan 29, 2020 6:55 pm

Retiring the entire starting 5 from one team was ridiculous. If that set our standard going forward there wouldn’t be a number left lol. Thankfully it didn’t.
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