RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by murraygrad05 » Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:56 pm

evvracerfan wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 10:00 pm
McMahon going to the 1-3-1 zone in the last 8 minutes really threw SIU for a loop for 3 or 4 possessions and allowed us to open up the big lead. Nice change of pace by coach.
He did that also in the Tennessee game and it was effective. Had to do a double take to make sure I was really watching a Murray game.

As for Robinson, remember that he is a 18 year old that went from being the star on a high school team to playing behind 2 seasoned seniors and a dominant sophomore. It would be extremely hard not to be frustrated. But his time will come. Just gotta keep working hard and earn his spot in practice.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Player Game Ratings

Post by 75Fan » Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:45 pm

Here's the player ratings for this game….81.26.

			
K. J. WILLIAMS		134.0761

TEVIN BROWN		122.8600

AARON COOK, JR.		115.6205


DARNELL COWART		 94.3632

CHICO CARTER		 89.9595
MARCUS DOMASK		 89.1683

ERIC MCGILL		 76.4127
ANTHONY SMITH		 74.6722
RONNIE SUGGS, JR.	 72.3168

HARWIN FRANCOIS		 65.0774

BARRET BENSON		 59.2814

DEVIN GILMORE		 46.3025


JAIVEON EAVES		 24.0217

JASON HOLLIDAY		 13.4684
SEKOU DEMBELE		 12.9574

STEVAN JEREMIC		  6.4989
TRENT BROWN		  6.4548
DAQUAN SMITH		  5.1235

LANCE JONES		- 4.5741
BRANDON GOOCH		- 4.5741
Last edited by 75Fan on Wed Nov 20, 2019 12:03 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by 75Fan » Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:47 pm

Here's the statistics for this game…..

		
STAT	 MSU 	 SIU 
FG MADE	 22 	 22 
FG ATT	 49 	 57 
FG %	 44.90 	38.60
		
3P MADE	 5 	 7 
3P ATT	 11 	 21 
3P%	 45.45 	 33.33 
		
FT MADE	 30 	 15 
FT ATT	 39 	 24 
FT%	 76.92 	 62.50 
		
O REBS	 11 	 11 
D REBS	 31 	 19 
T REBS	 42 	 30 
		
FOULS	 18 	 23 
		
ASSISTS	 10 	 9 
TOS	 10 	 10 
		
BLOCKS	 3 	 4 
STEALS	 8 	 6 
		
POINTS	 79 	 66 
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by 75Fan » Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:59 pm

Here's the players' Net Game Ratings for this game…..

	
ANTHONY SMITH	  6.1755

TEVIN BROWN	  5.4523


AARON COOK, JR.	  3.2372

CHICO CARTER	  2.8219
K. J. WILLIAMS	  2.7952
DARNELL COWART	  2.6361
HARWIN FRANCOIS	  2.3139

BARRET BENSON	  1.4484

MARCUS DOMASK	  0.6598
DEVIN GILMORE	  0.4561
LANCE JONES	  0.0000
BRANDON GOOCH	  0.0000

JASON HOLLIDAY	- 0.0037
JAIVEON EAVES	- 0.2427
STEVAN JEREMIC	- 0.2786
SEKOU DEMBELE	- 0.3888
TRENT BROWN	- 0.9500


RONNIE SUGGS,JR.- 2.2313
ERIC MCGILL	- 2.3627



DAQUAN SMITH	- 5.6426

===========================

DEMOND ROBINSON		DNP
NOAH KAMBA		DNP
ROD THOMAS		DNP
BRION WHITLEY		DNP
MATT SMITH		DNP

BEN HARVEY		DNP
KARRINGTON DAVIS	DNP
WILL KELLER		DNP

Last edited by 75Fan on Wed Nov 20, 2019 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by murraygrad05 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 12:39 am

39 free throws... :roll:
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by runningracer » Wed Nov 20, 2019 1:02 am

It may be that coach is trying to give his older players minutes early in season. It took awhile before Williams became a fixture last year. I sure hope Robinson starts getting the defense going in practice, and makes coach play him. A big adjustment in DI is having to play as hard in practice as in a game. If he is patient, and works hard, he will get all of the time he wants next year. I hope to see him more this year, and maybe coach will install a big man group, where he wants to dominate inside, and uses three bigs, instead of three guards, with Williams flashing to the wing, or to the top to help keep the defense honest. Brown, and Carter, along with Williams, Robinson, and one of Smith/Cowart/Gilmore,would be tough to handle. As Rick Flair would say, "WOOOO!!! :shock:
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by smidge34 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:33 am

I’m not the head coach, don’t see Demond daily and will defer to his judgement but if I were head coach I’d be playing him every minute I felt he was ready to play. He’s gonna be a beast.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by evvracerfan » Wed Nov 20, 2019 7:31 am

runningracer wrote:
Wed Nov 20, 2019 1:02 am
It may be that coach is trying to give his older players minutes early in season. It took awhile before Williams became a fixture last year. I sure hope Robinson starts getting the defense going in practice, and makes coach play him. A big adjustment in DI is having to play as hard in practice as in a game. If he is patient, and works hard, he will get all of the time he wants next year. I hope to see him more this year, and maybe coach will install a big man group, where he wants to dominate inside, and uses three bigs, instead of three guards, with Williams flashing to the wing, or to the top to help keep the defense honest. Brown, and Carter, along with Williams, Robinson, and one of Smith/Cowart/Gilmore,would be tough to handle. As Rick Flair would say, "WOOOO!!! :shock:
For a lineup with 3 bigs to work, one of our bigs has to guard a wing player on the perimeter that will be a lot quicker than Cowart, KJ, or Robinson. It's pretty tempting to see how much we could dominate the boards and inside play on the offensive end, but we would struggle on the other end of the floor IMO. Last night showed that Cowart is still not ready to guard people on the perimeter at this point in the season. There will probably be several chances to use a bigger lineup this season, but I would anticipate that if it happens Gilmore would be one of the 3 bigs because he's got a better chance of staying with a wing on the perimeter on defense.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by Dan T » Wed Nov 20, 2019 8:58 am

Yes, two of our bigs have faster reflexes than Brown, and he's holding his own with his length and hustle.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by msuowns » Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:52 am

smidge34 wrote:
Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:33 am
I’m not the head coach, don’t see Demond daily and will defer to his judgement but if I were head coach I’d be playing him every minute I felt he was ready to play. He’s gonna be a beast.
He was who I was looking for the whole game, like many others. Maybe this will do him good tho.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by wallaceracer » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:08 am

75Fan wrote:
Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:59 pm
Here's the players' Net Game Ratings for this game…..

CHICO CARTER 5.6763

DAQUAN SMITH -6.4200
:shock:
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by 02Racer » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:41 am

Man, I love Gilmore’s game. He always seems to come up with big plays on both ends at the perfect time.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by smidge34 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:00 am

02Racer wrote:
Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:41 am
Man, I love Gilmore’s game. He always seems to come up with big plays on both ends at the perfect time.
I almost posted in response earlier if you believe in those NET numbers go look at Gilmore’s negative and then never look at them seriously again.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by JoeD » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:29 am

Demond is in a tough spot. He has four guys ahead of him (only really two at his position) for minutes. Before the season, floated the idea of three forwards with Smith at the 3, but never could figure out if it would actually work. Whats funny is that you could, with the development of his jumper, put KJ at the 3 on offense in rotation with Smith (sin this case, both Smith and KJ make great roll options in the PnR, and KJ a pop option in the PnR).

The problem is that if you do that, either you have Brown/Eaves bringing the ball up, or you have Chico/Quanny at the point, but taking minutes from Eaves or Brown.

(to illustrate this the five on the floor in these would be something like Brown (Eaves), Eaves (Carter/Quan), Smith, KJ, Cowart (Demond))

This could work when we are looking to get Brown some rest, foul issues, etc.

I could see going big in spurts by the end of the year. Especially if Darnell gets 100%.

As for the frosh PGs, rarely do freshmen grow linearly. I expect both will progress in fits and starts this season. As I have said before, the learning curve is very high for PGs, but man they are talented.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by Racer2112 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 1:24 pm

I'm not real crazy about the idea of 3 bigs on the floor at once. I think defensively we will get spread out and torched (especially by teams like Belmont). Smith and Gilmore play defense with their hands too much on the perimeter and I'm afraid they will pick up a lot of cheap fouls. don't think any of the others have agility/quickness to guard around the perimeter.

Zone may be a better option than man if we wanted to try a big lineup. Just keep those hands up and make someone shoot us out of it from deep.

On offense I think it might just screw up spacing and generate low percentage, contested shots. KJ's ability to step out and create space is useful because it unclogs the lane. If we have another big in there that space is a mess again.

I'm excited about all of our bigs, but the freshman may just have to wait his turn or play so well he forces someone else to the bench. Basketball isn't played like it was in the 80's anymore, if there was more efficiency in 3 bigs at once then we would see it at higher levels.



On the Carter/Smith dilemma, they are both inexperienced and mistake prone. I think Chico has more ability to create his own shot and is better in transition. Smith seems like be better at running a half-court offense and a little more solid on D. I think for his career Chico has the higher ceiling, but currently a lower floor. It's probably going to be a game situation issue for awhile. They both have a lot of growing to do.

Just my :twocents: . Love seeing a Racer win!
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by JoeD » Wed Nov 20, 2019 1:35 pm

You make good points and a big lineup would be a short time measure, not something that we would employ full time.

Worrying about "clogging the lane" would be an issue if we didn't have bigs coming out of the post to set screens, with the other big sealing his man and allowing the ball handler to get to the hole. If the defense were to collapse onto the post to stop the drive, we would have kickout options who could knock down shots. (Either Brown or Eaves and as a third option, KJ)

You could also run out the bigs, emptying the post of bigs and allowing Smith to drive the lane or the baseline, or allowing rolls to the post for KJ, or dribble penetration from Brown or Eaves.

Again, this would not be a wholesale change to the offense, more of a wrinkle to play against teams with a big time shotblocker, or a team that doesn't shoot particularly well from the perimeter, etc.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by 02Racer » Wed Nov 20, 2019 1:47 pm

Show of hands: A couple years ago who thought we’d have so many talented bigs, we’d be having discussions on how to shoe horn three of them on the floor at the same time?
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by JoeD » Wed Nov 20, 2019 2:01 pm

Not me, I’ll admit.

Just shows how well the staff has recruited. Pretty incredible if you ask me.

Hell, I distinctly remember a discussion on this board talking about how what the program needed was an athletic, big bodied big who could shoot with some range.

Cut to today- we have a 6’8” 270lbs beast with the feet of Astaire and the hands as soft as butter, and a 6’10” 245 lbs big who runs the floor, plays above the rim, and can shoot better than 37% from 3. And that doesn’t take into account the freshman on the bench who has shown flashes enough that we are trying to figure out ways to get him on the floor more.
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by 02Racer » Wed Nov 20, 2019 2:18 pm

With Darnell’s vision and passing ability, can we just run him at the 1? :lol:
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Re: RACERS vs Southern Illinois Game Thread

Post by Racer2112 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 2:35 pm

JoeD wrote:
Wed Nov 20, 2019 1:35 pm
You make good points and a big lineup would be a short time measure, not something that we would employ full time.

Worrying about "clogging the lane" would be an issue if we didn't have bigs coming out of the post to set screens, with the other big sealing his man and allowing the ball handler to get to the hole. If the defense were to collapse onto the post to stop the drive, we would have kickout options who could knock down shots. (Either Brown or Eaves and as a third option, KJ)

You could also run out the bigs, emptying the post of bigs and allowing Smith to drive the lane or the baseline, or allowing rolls to the post for KJ, or dribble penetration from Brown or Eaves.

Again, this would not be a wholesale change to the offense, more of a wrinkle to play against teams with a big time shotblocker, or a team that doesn't shoot particularly well from the perimeter, etc.
Pretty sure we're just going to agree to disagree on this one.

We haven't shown the ability to pull up off picks and hit 3's yet (not saying we won't), but until we do I'm having my big sag off every screen, and pull the guard through, if that lineup is out there.

If I'm the other team Anthony, Nell, Gilmore, and Demond can go wherever they want, I'm leaving my rim protectors in the paint.

It might still be a fun wrinkle to try out, but I'm firmly in the skeptical camp. I would love to eat crow on this one. I want to see enough minutes for all of our bigs.
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